…but if you're walking at the end, it's worth the effort.
David L. writes:
I have been an email subscriber for some time and have purchased one of your books.
Your guidance helped me avoid a potential social violent situation yesterday. I was in a restaurant eating lunch when another customer thought I was staring at him and his girlfriend. I overhead him make the comment that if "that mf'er doesn't stop looking at us, I'm gonna…" He was about twice as big as me, very muscular, tattooed and overall scary looking. I ignored his comments and went about reading my newspaper and thus a potential conflict was avoided. This could have easily escalated but I remembered your advice about avoiding violent situations if at all possible.
What troubles me is I feel like a wimp. Do you think I handled the situation the right way and what could I have done had he chosen to escalate the situation to a violent level?
David,
First off, I want to congratulate you on a job very well done. You successfully navigated and defused a sticky social situation that had the potential to get needlessly ugly. Everybody got to get on with their day. Nobody had to go to jail, the hospital, or the morgue.
In the social/antisocial realm, this is an absolute victory.
But it isn't easy, is it?
If it were easy, we wouldn't even have to talk about it. Hurting people is easy–it's everything else that's hard. Navigating that social fog, using empathy to suss out emotions, body language, voice and social skills to steer the situation into calmer waters. Whether it's talking your way out of trouble, ignoring it and disengaging, or simply getting out of there, that stuff's complicated. What if he's just having a bad day? Or, deep down, insecure?
On my worst days, it's a struggle to be patient and let the stupid stuff slide, especially when that other guy has earned my anger.
And then there's always ego.
What if I look weak? Is it really victory if I let him 'win'? And my answer is that anything that gets you on to the rest of your day, the rest of your life, is victory. In the social arena this means avoiding the avoidable… in violence this means hurting people.
Successfully avoiding the stupid social stuff doesn't always feel good. There's the whole ego-driven aspect of feeling like a wimp, or a coward. And really, the problem there is that killer ego. It's important to leave ego out of anything that could edge toward violence… otherwise it can be the thing that drags you over the line.
What we'd all want to do in your situation, at least in our heart-of-hearts, is face down that guy and tell him just where he could stuff it, give him the icy stare, make him afraid and then, if things got out of hand, beat the living daylights out of him in front of his woman. That would show him. And make a hell of a story to tell our friends, to boot.
I think we all know that's not how reality tends to work out.
You risk getting stabbed or shot to death, getting knocked down and brained on the concrete. At the very least you're going to be marked up and unnerved with loose teeth. Or, if we flip it, best case scenario gets you sued for medical expenses, worst case is prison for manslaughter.
And for what? Ego.
So much less hassle to just let it go, claim the moral victory and enjoy the rest of your uncomplicated day.
Everyone I know who's made a serious study of violence, of taking the human body apart, of stomping people into the ground so they can't get back up, all those people will literally go out of their way to avoid the avoidable.
In terms of ego, I will admit that this is made far more palatable by coming as a choice, instead of feeling like it's your only option. In other words, it's a lot easier to let a jerk have his way if you know what to do on the other side of that. Knowing how to hurt people allows you to graciously accept the luxury of choice.
If you're feeling bad about it because you didn't feel it was a choice, but rather the only thing you could do, I recommend you train to give yourself other options, if only to take the ego out of the equation, to divorce yourself from the idea that:
social threat –> aggression –> violence
is an unavoidable, everyday chain of events. And then I recommend you keep on keepin' on, just like you did, successfully avoiding the avoidable.
Daily victories like that earn you the same thing as hurting people in life-or-death situations: it gets you out of a sticky patch and into the rest of your life.
Keep up the great work!
Chris Ranck-Buhr
TFT Master Instructor
PS. As for what to do if the situation had escalated, there's always getting the hell out of there. Again, much easier to do when it's a choice. If it got to him doing violence to you, the only answer, unfortunately, is to hurt him (that's why we have self defense classes & DVDs).
It's also why we go out of our way to let the stupid stuff slide. Once you cross that line, there's only one answer, and it ain't pretty, and no one's going to be happy when we're done.
PPS. Lastly, I've been in restaurants where the seating and lack of decor is such that every time you look up, you're staring right into the face of another customer. And since repeatedly looking at someone can be construed as aggression, this can lead to situations like yours.
I remember a story from a guy I trained with long ago, from when he was traveling in Thailand. This guy was a no-nonsense, get-straight-to-it kind of guy, and if it looked like violence, he'd be the first to get at it.
He was sitting in this cafe and every time he looked up, this tough-looking ex-pat was staring right at him. He tried to let it go, but after several minutes of this he figured if it was on, he was going to get it done first. So he pushed back from the table and got up to go after the guy–and noticed that there was a TV above his head with the sound off. The guy was just watching TV.
He sat back down and finished his meal in chagrined silence. Ever since that moment he always took the extra second, when given the choice, to be sure the threat was real before hurting people. And he always felt that it cut down dramatically on the number of bad situations he ended up in.


good information-walking away will save ones butt-it takes a man to walk-and live to talk another day-same thing happened to me in wonchi hong kong-i was in a bar and 2 guys sat next to me-one closest to me said about the same thing about me-so i just finished my drink and left the area-but i did observe a emty ber bottle near me that i could have used if need be-whitewolf
Comment by whitewolf — October 19, 2009 @ 11:55 pm
Wow, what fantastic insight and superlative advice here. The most important thing that training has taught me personally is how and when to avoid violence; I could not agree more with this post. This is correct application of correct principle. Everyone involved with any form of combat training can benefit from understanding and employing this model. Thank you again for this pearl.
Tim
Comment by /\/\ /\ /\/ /\ — October 20, 2009 @ 12:08 am
Excellent advise here. I have worked in emergency services for years, and have had my fair share of run ins. The difference that I had to face is that we have to come up with ways of controlling the situation without causing extreme injury(which sometimes would be so easy) as you deal with the various types of drug users, psycotics, drunks and general jerks. Sometimes violence can't be avoided, but I have never felt like a wimp for defusing a situation verbally over throwing down with someone… and everyone is a lot less sore the day after.
Comment by Power4more — October 20, 2009 @ 1:07 am
GREAT ADVICE! Choice subdues one's ego. I couldn't agree more. Keep these posts coming. Thanks.
Comment by David — October 20, 2009 @ 1:24 am
Hi Chris!
For myself, learning to walk away from an anti-social situation came with experience and maturity.
I think back to my youth where I wouldn't back down when a know nothing would "bait" me. In reality, think of it as walking into an ambush. You are bending to the other person's psychological will.Recalling long ago instances, I get chills thinking what could have happened to me when I allowed myself to be suckered into a fighting situation. I feel very lucky to be alive today.
That being said, I recently, in September, took TFTraining with Tim Larkin in New York City. Having had previous martial arts experience, I read Tim's book and wanted to train with him. I feel very fortunate to have had the honor to train with Tim and his crew. Having received TFT training, I will walk away from an anti-social situation even faster than before because there is only one way to fight and that is to injure your opponent. I will save my new fighting knowledge for an a-social run-in I hope never comes.
John Hock
Comment by John Hock — October 20, 2009 @ 4:24 am
It is said that if you loose your temper when being verbally attacked you may have already lost the fight .
Comment by Anonymous — October 20, 2009 @ 12:15 pm
I agree the most sucessful fight is the one you don't have. I am a gray haired grandfather and use this to my advantage. I try to be unfailingly polite and non-threatening. Wherever legal I am armed as I have some physical issues, but when the so-called law requires me to disarm, I stay in condition orange and I am prepared to do whatever is necessary to get myself and my loved ones home safe and unharmed. I have done my best to remove ego fron my response to a bad situation and consider myself sucessful if I can non-violently diffuse a potentially bad situation. If left no choice I will respond with quick and deadly force until the threat is removed, but I'd much rather take an insult than repond with possibly life threatening force. I just want the easiest safest way out I can find. Why should I car about the opinion of an anti-social bully. It's stupid to let yourself get goaded into a fight with words, not physical life-threatening actions. Words are gone with the wind, physical responses to them can stay with or ruin you for the rest of your life. The potential cost isn't worth the benefit.
Comment by TBILL — October 20, 2009 @ 5:32 pm
Regretfully, while in my youth, I was always quick to judge, had a bad temper, the type where I would jump out of my car and pound on the jerk tail-gating me or who ran me off.
Then one day, coming out of a restaurant with my wife, 1 year old and 5 year old, there was a group of salty looking dudes sitting on the hood of my beautiful BMW. I a split second, I rationalized from visually picking out who I would strike first to what might happen to my family if one of them got one in on me…I could see my wife and kids screeming and crying…all this mind you in less than 1 second!
What happened was that I calmly smiled at them…and said "hey guys, is it ok if we leave now?" They almost jumped off my car and for a moment I thought I saw a hint of embarrassment by a couple of them.
My kids are now 25 and 21, I'm 50 and I'll never forget that moment. I could take you to that restaurant and parking spot right now.
Walking away is a victory.
Comment by Anonymous — October 20, 2009 @ 6:48 pm
I completely agree with the post and the comments. Since I took the class in San Diego in May 2009, my whole life has changed for the better. I am able to walk away and avoid situations very easy by knowing that we can ALL be hurt or killed in a seemingly minor scrap. In the past my ego always made me feel like less of a man when I was able to avoid a fight by talking my way out of it.
I'm in the security business and it is part of my job to handle characters that loiter around our facility. These days, I always approach them with a smile and some conversation which makes them so much easier to deal with. It's like they can sense that I know a secret and it's OK for them to just "move along".
Life in general is so much better for me now. What a difference a weekend makes!
Thank You Chris!!!
Carlos
TFT Student
Comment by Carlos — October 20, 2009 @ 8:42 pm
It's easier to be polite in an armed society, because you know either one can kill the other. Thus you don't show your anger in rude conduct because you don't want to kill anyone, or have yourself killed. Thus an armed society defaults to a polite one, because everyone has to be self-controlled, or else.
Our society in America is a bit of a mix. A dangerous mix. Still got the alpha male aggression thing about territory and social status, still have some people armed with something, but society does not have the Code Duello or a modern equivalent and it is not nearly monolithically armed or trained.
Some are polite, others are not. Most situations are due to misunderstandings, but can escalate.
Chris R is right on a psychological level that it changes things if you decide to diffuse a situation rather than being forced to retreat. If you choose that situation, based upon your own analysis, you are not a wimp. You're the protector, the leader, the wise visionary, so to speak. If you decide to act, it is war. If you decide to act slightly differently, it can be peace for all.
That is an important decision to make. But you must have the confidence to choose what you see as the best course. IF you think your options are limited, due to fear of the other guy's aggression, you become motivated in striking out due to fear or you become motivated in backing off because of fear. Neither increases people's confidence. Taking counsel of one's fears is not a particularly good idea when decisive action is called for.
Instead take counsel of what you value. If you value a law abiding environment, where people are secure and free, then you must help contribute to such an environment. Creating problems where they didn't exist, upsetting more pacific individuals or families out to have fun, would be indecorous.
There comes a point when it doesn't matter whether you get hurt or not, live or die. If you can make a decision based upon all the odds, when everybody else is losing their heads, you've acquired a very nice ability to make decisions under pressure. That's useful both personally and for greater society.
TFT can help by giving you the tools. If you will be the one that chooses to be the decider.
Comment by Ymarsakar — October 20, 2009 @ 10:14 pm
This was such an outstanding post. The most down to earth straight forward information I have read by your group so far and I own your books.
Years ago I practiced TFT principles without even knowing it. Three friends from work and I were going out for lunch after a half day of teaching high school. It was going to be lunch and some serious male bonding and hanging out into the night. We stopped at the local pub and as we walked in the door a very large and muscular man bumped me and pushed his way ahead of me into the pub. I held my ground to some degree, but he outweighed me by 100lbs easily. My friends gave me the "what was that all about" and I just shrugged and said "I don't know that guy went out of his way to bump into the smallest guy of the group".
We sat down to order some lunch while that guy sat at the bar and stared us down while drinking a beer. A few minutes later, he walked up to us and very politely asked us if we were going to be here for a little while. We responded that we were staying for lunch and he politely said "oh ok" and walked out.
A minute later the bartender came up and asked us what happened and we told him how he just bumped me and we didn't have words or anything. He then informed us that the guy just said that he was going down the street to get his crew and come back and kill those motherf***rs.
We all agreed to leave at that moment and go somewhere else. It would have been very easy to play the role and say "there's four of us and we didn't do anything so we're not leaving. We could have relied on the bouncer and the fact that we were in a public place during the afternoon.
However, we still to this day tell the story and we ended up going on to have a fantastic night after the initial adrenaline rush wore off. I'm sure that this would have been a much different memory and night had we stayed to feed our egos.
Thanks again for all that you guys do to help prevent violence as much as you help to protect from violence.
Comment by Mike — October 20, 2009 @ 10:16 pm
This post really reminded me of a book I recently read on the subject: Meditations on Violence. It's an excellent book written by a fifteen year veteran corrections officer discussing many things ranging from criminal personalities, dealing with adrenaline cocktails, awareness, de-escalation, social violence (which he calls the "Monkey Dance") and the list goes on. I think the book is an excellent combination with TFT principles and training, and if you haven't read it Chris, Tim, Torin, and everyone else, I highly recommend it. The author places this same situation in a definable social context of competition for dominance over another male and that it is usually not fatal… so why bring it to a fatal level by injuring the guy for making a threat… sure he might be neutralized- but you might end up with a few holes yourself in the process all because of a few words.
Anyway, excellent article and info as always.
Comment by Chris Geer — October 24, 2009 @ 1:15 am
Awesome advice Chris! I've found that after going through the various DVD's, I am able to walk away easier than before. I have a new found sense of confidence that allows me to leave the ego at the door.
I still have a lot to learn and don't look forward to the day when I have to prove just how much information I've absorbed. Until that day, walking away is fine – and much easier now.
Comment by John — October 29, 2009 @ 2:08 pm
David: I am glad to see that “cooler heads” prevailed & you managed to keep your emotions in check & walk away. Your post underlines my concerns about RBSD training and the psychology of it all. I have gone through my own journey of SD (self defense) systems and I have reached some personal conclusions. SD systems such as Krav Maga, Israeli Krav, Commando Krav, Russian Systema, and find that even Senshido incorporate techniques stolen from the foundation arts BJJ/JJJ, Muay Thai, Judo, Karate and even other hybrids like FMA or JKD. These systems may market themselves as “reality based” and therefore different from the underlying arts in their application, but the truth is that the core techniques are derivative. This is so prevalent that even incomplete systems, systems that don’t deal with every range of combat, like Senshido and Defendo/Combato will demand their students study other ma styles like Muay Thai/Kickboxing or BJJ as part of their overall training. Witness Senshido Montreal that has kickboxing classes (although Richard Dimitri will insist it’s not part of the core curriculum, just a nice fitness supplement) or British Defendo/Jui Jitsui under Clive Elliot. A kick to the gonads or an eye gouge is not an ultrasecret ninja technique.
I can’t speak directly for TFT as I have no experience of it, but I suspect it will not greatly differ.
Let me ask you this,why are you studying any specific MA art or system?
If it’s purely SD (then choosing a buffet style system such as any Krav version or hybrid system should suffice. You won’t be the best grappler or striker, but you will be able to do a little of everything and you will have the mentality of applying it in a street situation. However, this does have its downside. Do you want to train and exist in a “red alert” state, constantly preparing and envisioning that possible fight to the death lurking around every corner? Do you want to risk “fighting as you train” where your brain will go on autopilot without considering consequences? In Canada we can only use sufficent force to nullify the attack. A simple fist fight, responded to by pounding the attacker into uconsciousness, carotid choke holds, or pulling a knife on an unarmed assailant, if there are no other aggravating factors, will land you in jail. The old justification of to be judged by 12 or carried by 2 was never stated by anyone trying to make bail, losing their job due to criminal charges & paying a lawyer.
Then this brings us to the individual arts. Most ma’s do have some sort of street application. Some are more suited to fighting than others, like the slow flowing forms of traditional Tai Chi may have a martial legacy, but realistically it is an inner art versus an outer one. Another consideration is that some traditional ma’s take years of dedication to perfect or reach the point where the techniques could be employed on the street.
As for SD and traditional ma’s, here’s my opinion.
No matter how good a SD system is, it will never replicate the experience of mastery of the underlying art. A boxer practices throwing thousands of punches with the goal of setting up and landing a disabling shot. By huge quantities of repetition, minute attention to technique and coaching specific to the art, a boxer is a lethal hand striker. A SD practioner punches with the goal of just being good enough to repell an attacker and with the mindset that if hand strikes aren’t sufficient or appropriate then other techniques can be used. On the other hand, a boxer might be more prone to hand injury by fist fighting, than a karate practioner who will employ a variety of more protective style hand strikes. But a boxer with a street mentality will know enough to go for body blows, know how to take a hit, have great hand speed that can put a rapid finish to a fight before it transitions.
Most SD practioners are not able to generate comparable power or ability to someone who studies an individual art. A telling point is that Israeli Krav Maga Federation (UK) has an instructor requirement of at least 4 years boxing/kickboxing with good punching and kicking abilities, in addition to the SD background.
This leads me to these conclusions:
If your primary goal is to learn the most SD applications in the least amount of time then chose a system, any system.
Remember the least amount of time can be relative too, because if you determine you want to advance rank in a SD system most of them also take years to complete. In some systems, specific techniques such as disarms, that you might personally consider vital to your SD, are only taught at higher levels or through invitee seminars. Especially if you plan on only devoting a year or two, then pick a SD system. The average person only sticks with any ma, traditional or not, or ma club for less than 6 months. Also, most SD systems will claim to take on anyone regardless of fitness level.
If your goals are fitness and mastery of technique then choose a specific ma or cross train in a set of ma’s. It is far more efficient to be coached by someone who specializes than by someone who tries to fill in all the gaps. These arts would be in this order: boxing, muay thai, judo, bjj, fma. For street applications, I would pick up some seminars for knife or gun attacks or just supplement your training with some SD sessions. You won’t wind up with a certificate to chronicle all your accomplishments, but you will be a good fighter, in and out of the ring. It doesn’t take much to apply those “dirty street tricks” when you have superb underlying technique. Even maybe then, like so many others, you’ll become a SD instructor.
Comment by J Mackie — December 9, 2009 @ 4:58 pm
I just wanted to add, to your p.p.s. Walking away is always the better part of valor. However, on the flip side of that my pops always told me when I was a kid, “If you know your gonna get it on, get it on, don’t wait.” Then I remember watching one of your guys’s vids and Tim says,” I am always asked how will I know when to use this or not use this? Don’t worry about it, you’ll know. You won’t have a choice.” There in lies the answer to did I do the right thing or not. Did you have a choice? If you did, and you walked away, you made the right one. If you didn’t have a choice and you had to fight, well, then you do what you gotta do, and get it on, but don’t wait.
Comment by Nick — January 1, 2010 @ 4:52 am